Gary Numan Digest Thu, 18 Feb 99 Volume 1 : Issue 513 Today's Topics: ahhh ... the 80's ... change of email address Gary Numan Digest V1 #512 I love this! In response to the Tic Tok Man digest 511 More on the Marilyn Manson situation My Brother's Time Newsletter Numan fan de-lurking-- Tah Dah! Numan Song Books/Tablature What about T-shirts? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 00:48:48 +0300 From: "Peter Enright" Subject: ahhh ... the 80's ... To: "Digest Numan" Received this recently and methinks that some Numanoids may be amused: Do you remember all of these? Love in the Eighties I was working part time in a five and dime. My boss was Mr. Magee. He was six foot four and full of muscles and walked like an Egyptian, but I was happy to be stuck with him. One manic Monday, while I was busy working for the weekend, I overheard him make a careless whisper. He told two of my co-workers, Jack and Diane, that I gave love a bad name. Well, I got so emotional, baby. I told him to say say say what he wants, but don't play games with my affection. He told me it was hard for him to say he's sorry and not to worry, to be happy. Then he blamed it on the rain. He was so out of touch. It just took my breath away. I couldn't fight this feeling any longer. I asked him "What's love got to do with it?" He told me to get outta his store and his dreams and into my car. So I figured I might as well jump. I cut footloose, went home and called my girl, Jenny. (You already know the number.) She was on the other line with Amanda. They were talking about Mickey and how he was so fine. That blew my mind! Was she really going out with him? I told her that I had just called to say I love her. She told me she had been saving all her love for me,but now she was looking for a new love - hasta la vista, baby. I thought "I can't go for that - no can do! Bring me a higher love!" I called up some of my old west end girls, hoping that one of them would want to get physical all night long (all night). First I called Billie Jean he told me to beat it. I called Rosanna - her sister Christian blessed the rains down in Africa and then hung up on me. Come on, Eileen! ... no answer. Nobody told me there'd be days like these! I was feeling like the owner of a lonely heart. Then, out of the blue, my best friend's girlfriend (she used to be mine) Roxanne calls. Yes, the real Roxanne. She told me she still hadn't found what she's looking for and that she wanted to take on me. I said "I thought you were Jessie's girl." She said "Don't you want me? You don't have to put on the red light - I'm on my own." What a feeling! I had the eye of the tiger. Who was I f-f-f-foolin? Roxanne drove me crazy like no one else. She's a beauty! She blinded me with science, and weird science at that. There was always something there to remind me of her and I just knew that I'd have the time of my life. I wasn't about to la-di-da-di. Let's go, I like the nightlife baby. I jumped in my little red Corvette and rocked down to Electric Avenue. Here in my car I feel safest of all, so I got my mind set on her. When I got to her house (in the middle of her street) I ran. I rapped on her front door and to this rapper's delight, I heard a voice say "Who can it be now?" "Here I am, the one that you love", I replied. I let my love open the door and was immediately lost in her eyes. I felt like a virgin touched for the very first time. She loosened her blouse and said "Rock me Amadeus!" Now that's what I call romance. Well, I felt it was my prerogative to bust a move. I told her "I'll tumble for ya!" as I pinned her on the stairs, hungry like the wolf. Just then I felt an invisible touch on my shoulder. "Turn around bright eyes!" said a familiar voice. As I did, Jessie hit me with a sledgehammer of an uppercut that spun me right round like a record. He was hangin' tough and continued to roll with it, knocking the wind from beneath my wings - broken wings by this time. He rocked me tonight, for old time's sake, beating me from head to toe, until my True colours were black and blue and blood was spilling from my mouth like red, red wine. "You don't owe me money for nothing!" he snarled. At this point I was livin' on a prayer. I crawled back to my little red Corvette and drove home thinking about how my tainted love had cut like a knife - how it seems that every rose, truly, has its thorn. No longer do I want to know what love is. I think I'm confusing love with need. Love hurts. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 07:23:39 -0000 From: "Andrew West" Subject: change of email address To: "Numan Digest" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Digest please can you send further digests to andy@donutdesign.freeserve.co.uk = as my account at donut@city2000.net will be ending at the end of the = month. many thanks Andy West Donut Design 0181-660 4531 http://www.donut.co.uk Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Digest please can you send further digests to andy@donutdesign.freeser= ve.co.uk=20 as my account at donut@city2000.net will=20 be ending at the end of the month. many thanks Andy West Donut = Design 0181-660 4531 http://www.donut.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 11:20:57 -0800 From: "David Medina" Subject: Gary Numan Digest V1 #512 To: "Gary Numan" I have enjoyed receiving the Numan Digest. However, please remove me from your mailing list at this time. Thank you. D. Medina ---------- > From: numan@cs.uwp.edu > To: datta@cs.uwp.edu > Subject: Gary Numan Digest V1 #512 > Date: Saturday, February 13, 1999 11:00 PM > > > Gary Numan Digest Sun, 14 Feb 99 Volume 1 : Issue 512 > > Today's Topics: > Dance > Dance, video format's, album lists etc. > Exile Live album > Gary Numan Digest V1 #511 > Incoming! > more bollox from Moscow > My Brother's Time > My wiegh in on Dance > new email > NTFLT > Random replies > Random replies 2 > The Man Who Dies Every Day > The New Bible of Dating . . . (x11) > The New Bible of Dating . . . . (x11) > Top Tens, and Mick Karn > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 13:53:12 +0000 > From: Tom Gorham > Subject: Dance > To: "Gary Numan" > > I've lived all these years wondering if I was kinda weird in thinking > that Dance was Numan's best album. I've only got it on cassette (three > copies thanks to over zealous relatives circa Xmas 1981), but all the > talk about Slowcar to China and Cry the Clock Said (in my book the only > time Numan wrote some really decent lyrics), got me down to my local > record shop hunting for the CD. > > Tom Gorham > www.ybmag.com > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 08:05:50 -0000 > From: "GaryH" > Subject: Dance, video format's, album lists etc. > To: > > What a surprise this album was when it was launched. I remember going to > Dunne & Co (Hat company in the UK) and buying an exact replica of Gary's > trilby, a zoot suit in grey pinstripe and almost an exact match of the shoes > he wore on the album cover and to round it off a neat little gold broach > with Pearls on it. Me, Simon, Dave Hall and half a dozen female Numanoids > wandering around Bolton and Manchester dressed like extras from an early > 80's gangster movie :-) Not exactly the best thing any of us did looking > back and knowing the area's we wandered around like that in I can now look > back and smile nervously :-) > > The album was an extremely brave move for Gary and for me probably his best > album up until Exile (Although the two are hardly comparable I suppose). > > For me Dance was what made Gary Numan so interesting. Forget the trends, > the marketplace. Just put out what is right for you at the time. FUCKING > stonking album Dance, and I hated Funk and Level 42 type stuff (Lot of > reviews around the time compared these areas with Dance) but this was > something else. > > NTFLT - Great track. I like it those that don't, that's cool. No need to > slate anyone for not liking it. (Twonks) :-) > > James C, go for PAL. Not the tinned variety of course the video format. > It's a shame Betamax died a death as the best quality video of Gary's I have > is the "Touring Principle" on Betamax Format. Fortunately I still have a > good Beta player. > > Listing of fave albums. Booooring, sorry guys and gals but I hate it, I > can't be arsed reading them, it's personal to you and irrelevant to me. I > skip these on the digest and have probably missed other interesting stuff in > your posts because of it. Gary put together a list once of his fave's but > hated doing it and later on started to refuse to do this further. > > Interesting though that James got a tremendous response from others who > obviously enjoyed compiling their lists but I wonder how many actually read > other fans compilations? > > > Bootlegs (Or interesting recordings I prefer to call them). > > Has anyone got a comprehensive list of audio tapes and videos that they > could/would be willing to e-mail me. Not too worried if you only have a > list of 10, 20 items but more comprehensive stuff will help if possible. > Please would you e-mail them to Gary@g-hough.prestel.co.uk (Many Thanks) > > Regards for now > Gary > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 02:25:09 -0800 > From: theartdept@att.net (rod reynolds) > Subject: Exile Live album > To: numan@cs.uwp.edu > > Hello. > > Cleopatra recorded the (May 19, 1998) L.A. show on digital video tape. I > saw some of it at the office and the sound and picture quality was amazing. > At the time, they were considering releasing it as a home video and/or > live album. They released a clip of Down in the Park with Marilyn Manson > to MTV (??!!!) who aired it, subsequently causing Manson's management to > freak. At the time, Marilyn's new album was still several months away from > being released. Still not sure the *exact* reason, but they vowed to sue > if the footage ever saw the light of day. > > Cleo management didn't want to release the video without the Manson > appearance and decided to wait until the storm blew over. Meanwhile, they > discovered that one of the tapes had irreparable damage on the sound track, > thus ruling out a live album and probably video release. I have asked > several times (ie how about releasing what is there, how much is damaged, > anything give me anything...) but it appears to be a dead issue. > > Sadly. > > They get tired of me bugging them about Numan things. > > Rod > Los Angeles > > > >Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 09:30:27 GMT0BST > >From: "James Chapman" > >Subject: Live albums > >To: numan@cs.uwp.edu > > > Another thing about live albums, is aren't we due another one? > >It's been 4 years since the last one which is about the norm for gaps > >between live albums. I believe there was one of the concerts from the > >US tour recorded so how about that being released, Rod? I have a > >bootleg from the US tour, and I reckon it could be one of the best > >live albums if it's mixed properly. It probably wouldn't be as good > >as "White Noise" though :-) > > >James > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 99 1:34:13 CDT > From: newlands@mercury.bact.wisc.edu > Subject: Gary Numan Digest V1 #511 > To: numan@cs.uwp.edu > > This is an automated message from the Mercury Mail Transport System. > ************************************************ > I will be away until Friday, February 12th. I will try to check my email daily > but may not be able to. You may try to reach me on the departmental cell phone > at 608-219-6501 but I can't guarantee that I will be reachable. > > Janet > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 19:22:09 EST > From: SomaCrow@aol.com > Subject: Incoming! > To: numan@cs.uwp.edu > > On coming: > > The French "petite mort" is nothing more than a slang term for "orgasm," just > as "little death" is here (although it's a bit antiquated)... if it is a > French slang term at all. I don't particularly wish to ask my French teacher > about it. "Orgasm" in French is....... "orgasme." (masculine noun) The verb > for "to have an orgasm" is "jouir," which also means "to enjoy." I think that > makes sense :-) This verb also spawns another term for "orgasm," the feminine > noun "jouissance." > > There is an Alternative French Dictionary at > http://www.notam.uio.no/~hcholm/altlang/ht/French.html which may have further > terms on this subject, as it is a very naughty dictionnaire. "Petite mort" is > not in it. > > My 2 centimes. > > -Riana > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 15:38:35 +0300 > From: "Peter Enright" > Subject: more bollox from Moscow > To: "Digest Numan" > > Ahem, > > A short note to rod reynolds: Gaz's "Warriors" costume was > most definitely inspired by Australia's very own > leather-clad road warrior Mad Max (Mel Gibson) movies and I > think this was before the release of Blade Runner. Just so > you know ... > > I still reckon some of the Numan album covers would make > great framed posters. I suggest: > > Replicas (of course) > The Pleasure Principle > Dance > I, Assassin > Berserker > Isolate > > I think many Numanoids would save up their pennies and > purchase these for their bedroom walls. What do you think? > Any chance you can start a poster business on the side Rod? > To my knowledge Numan's own site is not selling these. Just > an idea. > > BTW I thought that orgasm in French was "le cum" ... > > TikTokMan > > A proud member of "Members Like Us" > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 08:32:37 -0800 > From: Pythoness > Subject: My Brother's Time > To: numan@cs.uwp.edu > > Having waved my opinion about Strange Charm around, I'll join the nattering > about Dance. > > Now, my one real-life Numanoid friend LOVES Dance and we played a couple of > the tracks off of it (neither one was one of my favorites) on bass & guitar > until I was almost ready to smash the CD--however, I do think it's a neat > album. It's not one of my favorites--at the time it seemed rather > derivative (primarily of Japan, which was a group I fancied) and too > consciously orchestrated, resulting in merely doing something else other > people were doing, and I Liked The Earlier Stuff Better. > > Besides which, I do find the album a wee bit depressing, but that's not > because of the content but because of what was going on when it came out, > and can't be said to be Gary's fault, eh? > > Now--I think it's an amazing work and *very* well-crafted, and has some of > THE best lyrics. My top fave off the album is the evil "My Brother's > Time," followed neck and neck by "Moral" and "Cry the Clock Said." > "Slowcar" is a wonderful song, too, but it's one of those I find terribly > depressing. The heavy slow guitar and ponderous intro to "Moral" is one of > Gary's first of that kind which we're still hearing today, like a very > large machine gathering steam, though the intros became so long at times > that they might well be classed as entirely different songs. > > Now. I've heard a lot of different interpretations of "My Brother's Time" > over the eons, but not the one that I have, which is, to wit, ahem--that > it's a song about the narrator and his brother sleeping with the same > prostitute. Well? > > zg > > Ziggy Blum > Ziggy's House O' Vermin > zigi@ravenland.com > http://www.ravenland.com/index.htm/index.htm > Updates delayed by procrastination! Check back eventually! > --------------------------- > The greatest insult that can be offered to a man, comme il faut, is to > seize him by the Cravat; in this case blood can only wash out the stain > upon the honour of either party. --H. LeBlanc, "The Art of Tying the > Cravat" > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 13:14:25 -0800 > From: Robert Trousdale > Subject: My wiegh in on Dance > To: Gary Numan > > Well, let's see, where do I start... It was the fall of 1981. I had > just discovered Gary that summer when I heard "Cars" for the first time > and had to have the Pleasure Principle. I'm in New York City for the > first and so far only time, when I see the tape of Dance in the new > releases section. Only later would I realize that most of Numan's > albums were released in the fall... until recently that is... > > ANYWAY. Dance was my second Numan album. Having not had the > "transition" album of Telekon to listen to, I was rather shocked by the > stylistic change... On TPP, we have the broad sweeping BIG analog Synth > sound, Dance is well... far more eclectic. But you know what? I liked > it! At that point, I figured, if I liked both Dance and TPP, I would > probably like anything Numan put out. And I was right, at least so far > :-) > > Dance Blow by Blow: > > Slowcar to China: This song is my all time favorite slow Numan song. I > love the sliding bass throughout the album first introduced here... wow. > > Night Talk: A kick ass song, I suppose don't you? (yes I know that line > is from Slowcar :-) I especially love that low synth used to accent the > bass line... > > Subway Called You: One of the first indications, to me at least, that > Numan could write songs that really made the hair on my neck stand up, > not that the words are especially dark, but the whole atmosphere of the > song is just... well, creepy sorta. I think Numan was hearing the same > muse when he wrote "My Breathing" > > Cry The Clock Said: Um, actually, I don't like this song much. One of > the few Numan songs that is an Auto Skip for me. > > She's Got Claws: WOW! Funking Cool! Almost wish Gary had done a pure > Funk album (shudder the door indeed :-) > > Crash: One of two songs on this album that reminded me of TPP. I liked > all of TPP, so natch, I liked this one too... I don't know what Gary > does to his guitar here, but I bet it was pissed at him after the song > was recorded :-) > > Boys Like Me: I found the italian female singer a neat little gadget > that truly compliments the story of this song. And boy is that bass > line infectious! > > Stories: A nice little story song with one of the catchiest riffs in > any Numan song. Could almost have been a pop song? Eh, maybe not. > > My Brother's Time: Another song I am not very fond of... but not an > Auto Skip, Way to base an entire song around a standard piano scale > Gary! Cool! > > You Are You Are: A faster song than any of the others on the album, and > one I always have to turn up so loud I bleed my ears... > > Moral: The other song that reminds me of TPP, for obvious reasons, I > actually thought for a short while (until I got my third album) that > maybe Gary had a "Metal / Moral" like song on ALL of his albums... that > might have been a neat idea, but only in theory :-) > > Overall, quite a different album from my first, but once I got Telekon, > it was farily obvious to me how Numan got from TPP to Dance, and when I > Assassin was released the following year, I could see the natural > Progression there too... > > To me, Numan's albums generally fall into two catagories: Style > builders and Whoa Where did that come from? > > So, The Plan, Tubway Army, those are Style Builders... > Replicas and TPP, are WWDTCF? > Telekon, Dance, I Assassin, Warriors, there is a natural progression to > these albums, > Berserker? WWDTCF? > The Fury and Strange Charm built on the flaws and successes of > Berserker. > Metal Rhythm? WWDTCF? Outland? WHAT WAS HE THINKING??? > Machine and Soul? Built on Outland, and improved on it I think. > Sacrifice, Exile... Take out everything between Telekon and M&S, you > might find a progression there. > > Eh, that's enough bait for one month :-) > > -Escher > Not a Boy like Us, my wife would kill me :-) > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 00:33:56 +0000 (BST) > From: Jackie Taylor > Subject: new email > To: numan@cs.uwp.edu > > please send me the digest at my new address. > > new address jackie.taylor@dtn.ntl.com > old address brooke.shields@netchannel.co.uk > > > > Jackie Taylor > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 16:27:28 -0500 > From: Matthew Roberts > Subject: NTFLT > To: Gary Numan > > Rod, > > I believe the version of NTFLT on Strange Charm is just the single versio= > n, > slightly rejigged by Gary - no re-recording or remix to speak of. The > lyrics (and therefore the vocals) are the only real change. > > I believe it only appeared on the LP because Gary didn't have enough song= > s > at the time, rather like U Got The Look on Machine & Soul (which was > recorded long before, at IRS's urging). > > Writing new lyrics for NTFLT was the best that Gary could manage in the > absence of a proper song. Even then, they were definitely of the Numan "c= > ut > and paste" variety. > > Having said that, I would guess NTFLT was Gary's favourite Sharpe & Numan= > > single, as it's certainly the darkest. Shame it was released on Numa :-( > > As a whole, I think the Sharpe & Numan era is something Gary would rather= > > forget, apart from the cash. > > Now who remembers "Love Like A Ghost"? > > Matthew Roberts > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 09:45:27 GMT0BST > From: "James Chapman" > Subject: Random replies > To: numan@cs.uwp.edu > > After my comments about Dance in #510, it would seem as though I'm > public enemy no. 1- well, not quite but it seems as though a lot are > opposed to my views. > > From: newcombg4@mindspring.com > > > I don't really understand how a comparison of Dance and Strange Charm came > > up! Yes, Dance is better than Strange Charm. > > In YOUR opinion, it is! > > IMHO, Dance is Numan's best > > album, and though I thoroughly enjoy Strange Charm, it isn't even in my > > Numan top ten. (In fact, I consider the albums up to Dance, including "The > > Plan", to be a different breed than all the subsequent albums, and I like > > the first breed better, so the first five albums plus The Plan are > > automatically my top six Numan albums.) > > > Well, you're deluding yourself :-). There's also NO WAY that The > Plan is better than Berserker, The Fury and Strange Charm. I can't do > with that punky guitar. That's the only album I don't have much > interest in. > > > I think of Dance as a major breakthrough for Numan, a lot of Numan > > trademarks appear for the first time on this album, for example the > > doppler-type sounds, and the glossolalic, lyric defying singing. > > > One thing IS the vocals - the difference between Telekon and > Dance was amazing- I must say I love Gary's voice slurring although > it's put to best effect on I, Assassin IMO. > > > As to the "incoherency", remember that Dance was originally an LP, with the > > four "ambient" tracks being side one and the rest side two. A lot of > > all-time great albums are also "incoherent" in this sense, like Bowie's > > Heroes and Low, and Remain in Light, by the Talking Heads. All of these > > albums, including Dance, manage to make a coherent statement somehow > > paradoxically because of the stylistic differences between the two sides. > > The track sequencing on CDs, particularly in the case of Dance, tends to > > destroy the album as a complete statement by the inclusion of bonus tracks > > and the omission of album tracks. > > > From: VinceH > > > James Chapman wrote:- > > > > > What I thought about this incoherent thing was - has nobody thought > > > that Dance is incoherent? > > > > Dance has its own consistency throughout, in terms of the music (but > > some tracks - eg SgC - stand out phenominally from the rest so as to > > make that inconsistency hard to see. How I would describe it is as the > > /least accessible/ of the Numan albums. I am certainly glad that it > > wasn't one of the first/earlier ones that I bought because it might > > well have been enough to put me off Numan[1] - and had that happened, > > I'd have missed Sacrifice and Exile. EEEEEEK!!! > > > Well, I HATED it at first with the exception of 2 or 3 tracks, > but the first 4 tracks are big growers, I'll give them that much. > > > > > I don't think I've really got "Cry, the Clock Said" - I LOVE the > > > second half where Gary is singing, but the first five minutes bore > > > the hell out of me. Unless I'm listening to it in the dark, of > > > course. > > > > I agree totally - I'd add that I could hardly listen to it at all on > > vinyl, due to the slight background noise; it was an old 2nd hand copy, > > after all. It is much easier, I find, on CD. > > > An amusing story I have about that song is when I bought Tubeway > Army/ Dance double pack, my hi-fi was on the blink so I put it on my > flatmate's hi-fi and cranked up the volume while I cooked dinner. "A > Subway Called You" finished and then I couldn't hear anything! I > thought the disc was knackered but it was just very quiet. > > > > "My Brothers Time" is an awful dirge, > > > > Hmm.. I think I'd have to say that's my favorite track on Dance! > > > Unfortunately, it's one of 3 Numan songs that automatically make > me reach for the FF button. "Emotion" and "Telekon", which is just as > dirgey are the other two. > > > > > > Oh.. as I scan through digest 509, I see:- > > > > James Chapman (gosh you pop up a lot! :-) says:- > > > Yep! I just enjoy contributing a lot, that's all. > > > > Indeed. That'll have been the backing vocalist, of course (I guess) but > > another thing which works in a similar way are sound samples; he used > > a lot (or rather "a *LOT*") on Outland, for example, and I reckon they > > add a whole different layer of atmosphere to the album. I wonder how it > > would have sounded without them... > > > I think the sound samples on that album are really quite cool, > but I wish Gary didn't submerge his voice in female vocals- there > ain't much of Gary singing alone on the album. I reckon it could have > been excellent if it had goneout the way Gary wanted it, but the > over-production gets a little bit annoying sometimes- WAY too much > perscussion. Take for example "Soul Protection" the piece on Human > that became that song is great, but I reckon it should have been that > track, Gary singing and the odd sample. Cut the annoying, sax please. > The sax made some songs from the 80s, but not here. It has more > consistency than Dance - it's just less listenable, that's all :-) > > > From: "Craig MacNeil" > So, when I put > > it on, I enjoyed it, but I was also confused by the overall style {st > > first}, and also tried to figure out why a single album was so long. > > Didn't this come out on one lp? Why does it say 1991 on the back, and > > other mysteries. > > The CD were the extended mixes, 6 of the 9 songs were longer than > the vinyl version. Much for the beter as well, I'd say. It's one of > my fave Numan albums.The 1991 on the back is when it became available > through the fan club on CD but didn't get general release till 1995. > Very confusing for someone who doesn't know the full story. Anyone > browsing wwould maybe think it wwas actually recorded in 1991 and may > be put off it as aresult of thinking it's in the same mould as > Outland or M+S. NUMACD 1001 is the 1995 reissue, the fan club issue > is very rare. > > To reply to the person about "Dance" being incoherent, I just > > listened to it again, and although I can see your point, I always feel > > moved listening from back to front, because it all has some kind of > > thread running through - I can't say what, but I can feel it. Also, > > wouldn't it drive you nuts if all the tunes were like "you are you are" > > or "moral"? > > Not me! Add in We Are Glass, I'm An Agent, I Die:You Die, > Crash....marvellous! > > > > > > > > James also added - > > >What I thought about this incoherent thing was - has nobody thought > > >that Dance is incoherent? > > > > I always thought Dance was fantastic, myself. I like side 1 the best, and I > > *love* Cry, the clock said, that song is hypnotic. 'There's nothing much to > > keep us alive but "Dance"' is a great line. I do think as a whole, 'dance' > > isn't incoherant, every song on there sounds like a 'Dance' song. What's > > the problem with 'My Brother's Time? > > The problem is, Antonio, is that I find it unlistenable. That clock > percussion bugs the hell out of me. It's so damn slow, it's funeral. > :-) > > Give me New Thing From London Town anyday :-) > > James > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 09:52:37 GMT0BST > From: "James Chapman" > Subject: Random replies 2 > To: numan@cs.uwp.edu > > Sorry, I had to do this sepately because the whole thing wouldn't > load in the reply field. > > > From: Kenneth.ZAZULA@st.com > > > > > Well, something had to do it....and it was James Chapman's message in > > the last digest that forced me out of lurking mode. Nobody messes > > with "Dance". > > > I haven't messed with it, just commented on it. If you want > messing, talk to IRS about Metal Rhythm being turned into New Anger > :-) > > > The horrifying revelation that I've had about what is by far my > > favorite Numan album..period, is that he's right. > > Thank You !!! Someone who understands. I never said it was bad, > just very mixed . Excpt the one song, that is. > > I find that it doesn't make the trip to the CD player as often as > some less popular albums, like Strange Charm for instance :-) > > James > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 15:57:49 -0800 > From: errora@earthlink.net > Subject: The Man Who Dies Every Day > To: numan@cs.uwp.edu > > Every Day I Die I might assume was inspired by the Foxx-era Ultravox > track, from ha!-ha!-ha!, called The Man Who Dies Every Day. I could be > very, very wrong but it seems to me to be a no-brainer. > > I remember opening The Bible at random some 18 or so years ago and > finding a verse saying something to the effect of, "Truly, I am the man > who dies every day." > > ------------------------------ > > Date: 11 Feb 1999 18:22:55 -0800 > From: "Our Publishing Comp." > Subject: The New Bible of Dating . . . (x11) > To: > > Women all over America have said, "Burn This Book!!!" > > CALL TO ORDER YOUR COPY - (800) 830-2047 [24hrs] > > How To Juggle Women: > Without Getting Killed or Going Broke > by Stefan Feller > > ISBN:0-9658299-4-4 > Price: $12.00 > > This book is an essential guide for the seasoned dating > man who needs help organizing the women in his life. > Women are constantly grabbing your interest and attention. > Do you have to choose on over the other? Of Course not! > Stop letting opportunities like these go to waste. > Why not date them all? > > This is a must-read for men who are active on the dating > scene. Not only will you learn how to juggle several > females at a time, you will also improve your overall > chances with women, including where to meet them and > how to do the little things to keep them happy. > > You will learn time-saving techniques that will maximize > your availability, and allow you to spend time with several > ladies a day. The author details scheduling methods so you > never have two dates at the same time. You will also learn > money-saving tips so you can date aggressively and still > have money left to buy life's other necessities. > > Forget the saying,"For every man there is a woman out > there." Now it will be, "For every man there are at > least three women." > -------------------------------------------------------- > CHAPTER TITLES > > Chapter One - Getting to Know You > Chapter Two - Categories of Women > Chapter Three - Where to Find Them > Chapter Four - The Rotation > Chapter Five - Prior Planning > Chapter Six - How to Keep Them Happy and Away From Each Other > Chapter Seven - Fiscally Fit > Chapter Eight - Personnel Changes > -------------------------------------------------------- > Juggling Women: > Without Getting Killed or Going Broke > by Stefan Feller > > ISBN:0-9658299-4-4 > Price: $12.00 > $3.00 Shipping individuals - COD Charges are free for a limited time. > Wholesale Discounts Available > > --------------------------------------------------------- > Order by Phone > 1 (800)830-2047 > 24 hours a day > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 08:52:01 -0800 (PST) > From: "Publishing_Co." > Subject: The New Bible of Dating . . . . (x11) > To: > > Women all over America have said, "Burn This Book!!!" > > CALL TO ORDER YOUR COPY - (800) 830-2047 [24hrs] > > How To Juggle Women: > Without Getting Killed or Going Broke > by Stefan Feller > > BSB Publishing > ISBN:0-9658299-4-4 > Price: $12.00 > > This book is an essential guide for the seasoned dating > man who needs help organizing the women in his life. > Women are constantly grabbing your interest and attention. > Do you have to choose on over the other? Of Course not! > Stop letting opportunities like these go to waste. > Why not date them all? > > This is a must-read for men who are active on the dating > scene. Not only will you learn how to juggle several > females at a time, you will also improve your overall > chances with women, including where to meet them and > how to do the little things to keep them happy. > > You will learn time-saving techniques that will maximize > your availability, and allow you to spend time with several > ladies a day. The author details scheduling methods so you > never have two dates at the same time. You will also learn > money-saving tips so you can date aggressively and still > have money left to buy life's other necessities. > > Forget the saying,"For every man there is a woman out > there." Now it will be, "For every man there are at > least three women." > -------------------------------------------------------- > CHAPTER TITLES > > Chapter One - Getting to Know You > Chapter Two - Categories of Women > Chapter Three - Where to Find Them > Chapter Four - The Rotation > Chapter Five - Prior Planning > Chapter Six - How to Keep Them Happy and Away From Each Other > Chapter Seven - Fiscally Fit > Chapter Eight - Personnel Changes > -------------------------------------------------------- > Juggling Women: > Without Getting Killed or Going Broke > by Stefan Feller > > ISBN:0-9658299-4-4 > Price: $12.00 > $3.00 Shipping individuals - COD Charges are free for a limited time. > Wholesale Discounts Available > > --------------------------------------------------------- > Order by Phone > 1 (800)830-2047 > 24 hours a day > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 03:32:00 PST > From: "Craig MacNeil" > Subject: Top Tens, and Mick Karn > To: numan@cs.uwp.edu > > Hallo again friends. > I finally ot around to my top ten lists. One is for Numan, one > non-numan. > Non-Numan: > David Bowie - "Diamond Dogs" > Roxy Music - "Stranded" > Bauhaus - "Burning From The Inside" > T.Rex - "The Slider" > The Rocky Horror Picture Show > Lou Reed - "Street Hassle" > John Cale - "Helen of Troy" > Brian Eno - "Taking Tiger Mountain {By Strategy}" > Bryan Ferry - "Let's Stick Together" > Robyn Hitchcock - "I Often Dream of Trains" > and no.11 - Cheap Trick - "Cheap Trick" > > Top Numan cd's: > "Dance" > "The Pleasure Principle" > "Berserker" > "Telekon" > "Tubeway Army" [not cuurrent issue, but the one with "Don't be a Dummy" > on it} > "I, Assassin" > "Sacrifice" > "Metal Rhythm" > "Replicas" > "Exile" > At least that's the current selection. Eight months ago I was playing > "Replicas" about three times a day, but I think I overdosed. > SO...... > Mick Karn - what happened between him and Gary? In one of the old "Ask > Gary" segments, Gaz was asked about him, and apparently said something > so nasty that Derek brought it to his attention, and Gaz withdrew the > comment. I am an avid Japan fan as well as the Dali's Car album that > Karn did with Peter Murphy, and I love gossip. Let me know. > Have a lovely day folks, it's time for my tea. > Craig > > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > ------------------------------ > > End of Gary Numan Digest > ****************************** > _______________________________________________________________________ > _____ ____ ____ _____ _____ > / \ | | / \ / \ / \ / \ > | |-----| |-----| | |-----| |-----| | > | | G | | A | | | R | | Y | | > | | | | | | | | | | | > | |-----| |-----| | |-----| |-----| | > | | | | | | | | | | | > | | | | | | | | | | | > | | | | | | | | | | | > | | | | N | E | W | S |=====| | | > | | | | | & | | | | | > | | \_____/ I | N | F | O | | | | > > is produced and distributed by Derek Langsford > dlangs@sunstroke.sdsu.edu > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > To reply to the messages in this list, mail to: > > numan@cs.uwp.edu > > If you want to be removed, or someone wants to be added, you can mail to > > numan-request@cs.uwp.edu > > ----------------- > The Gary Numan Digest is brought to you via > > Datta Production and Development, 905 97th Street, Kenosha, WI 53143 USA > datta@cs.uwp.edu > and > computer resources courtesy of University of Wisconsin-Parkside > and Datta Production and Development. > > All of the opinions in this digest belong to the respective authors and > do not necessarily agree with those of Datta Production and Development. > Datta Production and Development is not affiliated with University Of > Wisconsin - Parkside or the University of Wisconsin System. > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 15:34:57 GMT0BST From: "James Chapman" Subject: I love this! To: numan@cs.uwp.edu God, I love this digest. How biased are the views between the more popular Numan albums and the less popular ones? Bloomin' MASSIVE, that's how! Someone says "Strange Charm was a complete load of shite" and only I leap up in that album's defence saying it's one of my faves and that seems to spark up more discussion than the one who said it was shite. Then I go and say my comments about Dance being an album of two halves, inconsistent but good material except the one song and that seems to have tons of people defending it like I said it one of the worst records of all time :-). I do really enjoy listening to the first 4 tracks on their own, and tracks 5, 6,7,8,10, and 11 on their own. I just think the whole thing is less than the sum of the parts. 10 very good tracks though! Despite my relative criticsm of "Moral", I like it but I reckon it would have been better if "Metal" had never existed. I know I'm biased but "Metal" is one one my favourite songs. The same goes for "Cars" and "Observer "(Cars did come out before the album didn't it ?) Someone mentioned David Bowie's Low and Heroes and yes, I understand that, they are my fave Bowies, but the difference is the ambient "side" is the second. I would Dance would be better that way round, finishing with "Cry The Clock Said", but obviously Gary didn't want to do this as the press would have seen it as a Bowie rip-off. Also with the two sides story, being only 21 and about 10-15 years younger than the average Numanoid, I have only started buying music in the last 4 or 5 years and have only really been interested in CDs, I tend to only buy vinyl if I can't find what I want on CD. I have to also say if Gary had done I, Assassin and maybe even Warriors before Dance, he probably wouldn't have lost a lot of popularity. I am also very fascinated to the title of the album - when I got it I thought it would be dancey a bit like I,Assassin (yes I got Telekon/I Assassin before Tubeway Army/Dance). I've heard that there were 2 on 1's released previously which seems rather odd especially having Dance with Tubeway Army. Not as bad as having TPP with Warriors though :-) >From "GaryH" > Listing of fave albums. Booooring, sorry guys and gals but I hate it, I > can't be arsed reading them, it's personal to you and irrelevant to me. I > skip these on the digest and have probably missed other interesting stuff in > your posts because of it. Gary put together a list once of his fave's but > hated doing it and later on started to refuse to do this further. > > Interesting though that James got a tremendous response from others who > obviously enjoyed compiling their lists but I wonder how many actually read > other fans compilations? > > Maybe not many but when they are all compiled together you can do some constructive with them. The results are in the digest of November 19, 1998 which you can look at on The World Wide Webb. > From: theartdept@att.net (rod reynolds) > > Hello. > > Cleopatra recorded the (May 19, 1998) L.A. show on digital video tape. I > saw some of it at the office and the sound and picture quality was amazing. > At the time, they were considering releasing it as a home video and/or > live album. They released a clip of Down in the Park with Marilyn Manson > to MTV (??!!!) who aired it, subsequently causing Manson's management to > freak. At the time, Marilyn's new album was still several months away from > being released. Still not sure the *exact* reason, but they vowed to sue > if the footage ever saw the light of day. > Rod these comments are meant very tongue in cheek and I know it's isn't your fault but - SOD MARILYN MANSON! I can't stand him anyway, I want to hear Numan not Manson! Just cut that song out! It's not as though we're actually short of live versions of DITP anyway. :-) > Cleo management didn't want to release the video without the Manson > appearance and decided to wait until the storm blew over. Meanwhile, they > discovered that one of the tapes had irreparable damage on the sound track, > thus ruling out a live album and probably video release. I have asked > several times (ie how about releasing what is there, how much is damaged, > anything give me anything...) but it appears to be a dead issue. > Oh well, what a shame. Maybe next tour, then and hopefully there's no MM hoop-la :-). I reckon it would be really cool to have a 90's decent quality live Numan recording without Kipper going OTT every other track :-) Sorry if I've pissed anyone off - it isn't my intention. > > They get tired of me bugging them about Numan things. > Oh, no not another IRS. At least you're trying, Rod which is more than can be said for them. Can't understand why Rod was slagged off in the first place, OK the Fury cover was crap but it was crap in 1985. At least he tried to actually do something with it. Most of the Cleo stuff is great- I love The Mix album, and also the way the White Noise CDs have the snowed-on effect, a bit like The Pet Shop Boys' Bilingual CD. Pretty cool. > From: "Peter Enright" > I still reckon some of the Numan album covers would make > great framed posters. I suggest: > > Replicas (of course) > The Pleasure Principle > Dance > I, Assassin > Berserker > Isolate > What about The Fury or Machine and Soul? Well, maybe not! But Warriors could be good as well. Seriously! > I think many Numanoids would save up their pennies and > purchase these for their bedroom walls. What do you think? How about using old vinyl LP covers? If you've got all the Numan albums on CD like me and your vinyl isn't of much use then hang them up on your wall! I do that! I also have a Telekon poster on my wall which I found in an old vinyl LP I bought for two quid a few months ago. Posters themselves cost more than that! > Any chance you can start a poster business on the side Rod? > To my knowledge Numan's own site is not selling these. Just > an idea. > Yeah, good idea.. That's my rather large contribution for this week. Glad to see the size of the last 2 digests was a bit bigger, James ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 00:13:24 PST From: "Dalis Car" Subject: In response to the Tic Tok Man digest 511 To: numan@cs.uwp.edu >As a previous director of music videos >which have won awards, I feel that I have the right to sound >off my opinion: it sucks(Dominion Day). It has no real concept, or >the >kind of visuals that do the song the justice it richly >deserves. In fact it looks rather like an MTV style filmstudent Having seen all of Gary's videos, and taking into the fact that most of Gary's videos aren't very good. IMHO this is Gary's best video. >And while we're on the subject, let us not forget that it was a Scotsman who invented TV. Television's History -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Although the first practical television system began operating in the 1940s, some of the earliest work on television began in 1884, when German engineer Paul Nipkow designed a scanning disk. Light passing through the disk created crude television images. Nipkow's mechanical scanner was used from 1923 to 1925 in experimental television systems. An electronic method of scanning was used by Russian-born American physicist Vladimir Kosma Zworykin in his iconoscope camera tube of the 1920s. Cathode rays, or beams of electrons in evacuated glass tubes, were developed for use in television during the 1930s by the American electrical engineer Allen B. DuMont. DuMont's method of picture reproduction is essentially the same as the one used today. The first home television receiver was demonstrated in Schenectady, New York, in 1928, by American inventor Ernst F. W. Alexanderson. The images were small, poor, and unsteady, but the set could be used in the home. A television broadcasting boom began after World War II (1939-1945) and the industry grew rapidly. At first the development of color television lagged behind because it was technically more complex. Later it was delayed because color television signals would have to use the same channels as monochrome television and would also have to be receivable in black and white on monochrome sets. Compatible color television was perfected in 1953. Other developments that improved the quality of television were larger screens and better technology for broadcasting and transmitting television signals. Affordable video recorders were introduced in the 1970s and have since become almost as common as television sets. As on-line computer systems become more popular, effective means to integrate television and computers are being investigated. This integration would combine the capabilities of personal computers, television, and telephones, and would greatly expand the services these equipment provide. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >From Microsoft 1999 Encarta "Move upside, let the man go through." Soul Coughing "If I was ten years younger I'd take a flame thrower to this place!" Al Pacino Scent of a Women ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 15:30:03 GMT0BST From: "James Chapman" Subject: More on the Marilyn Manson situation To: numan@cs.uwp.edu Did my eyes totally decieve me or did I read that MM's management went haywire because they had a clip of him performing on MTV. Excuse me, but wouldn't this have helped promote the new album? Oh, no because being seen performing with Gary Numan would be seen as sad. How very sad of them. But then again Marilyn Manson is one very sad individual :-) I vow never to but a Marilyn Manson record ever. Which isn't too hard as I don't anyway- I think they're a load of shite! :-) James ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 13:20:50 -0500 From: Matthew Roberts Subject: My Brother's Time To: Gary Numan Ziggy, Gary and John using the same hooker? I disagree with that particular interpretation, although I suspect even y= ou aren't very convinced by it??? I think it's about the woman who tried to stitch Gary up in late 1980. At= the time the LP came out, Gary suggested in an off-the-cuff remark that t= he whole album was about her. An exageration perhaps but surely not too far off the mark. "If you should ever think of me, maybe as a game you lost" "In love with this elegant bitch" "Boys like me, from rags to riches, bleed for you" "See her shine with stars before they fade away" The probable exceptions are "Stories" which I believe was written before Gary found out what was happening and "Moral" which is about the biz. I think "my brother's time" was just a line tacked on to say "Even though= I'm a big star, you're just as important John". Ahh! But how about that line "like someone in Japan who just lied"? Coincidenc= e? David Sylvian? Connie Filapello? If so, it's strange that Mick Karn was still around playing his slinky bass. Craig, Allegedly (i.e. paranoid Gaz claims) Mick Karn agreed to slag off Dance i= n a music magazine, if the magazine in turn gave his latest record a good review. Now I don't doubt it's entirely possible, it's just that Gary doesn't always adhere to the highest standards of evidence. But then who does? >Every Day I Die I might assume was inspired by the Foxx-era Ultravox = >track, from ha!-ha!-ha!, called The Man Who Dies Every Day. I could be = >very, very wrong but it seems to me to be a no-brainer. Gary was asked about this in 1979. The answer? He claimed it didn't come from there, but the interview didn't offer an alternative explanation! Matthew Roberts ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jan 1998 15:14:36 -0600 From: "Alice Hartlaub" Subject: Newsletter To: Just a couple of thoughts. Somebody wondered if anyone really read everyone else's top 10 lists. I, for one, do and have enjoyed them. A couple of lyrics have always stumped me. If anyone has a clue what these mean, I'd appreciate it (maybe I'm just a dumb American). "... more roche five than pain " [from My Shadow in Vain] Does this really mean anything? I love the song, but don't get the "roche." "... about little deals and S.U.s and things ..." [from AFE] What is an "SU"? My two cents about "Dance" - I was a little put off when I bought it on vinyl, thinking it was quite different from Pleasure Principle and Telekon, but it's grown on me. "Slowcar to China" especially, although I rarely find 9 minute songs to be my favorites. I agree with some of you that thinking of the album as two sides of an LP with no bonus tracks (the way I originally heard it) makes the album seem more "coherent." It's not my favorite, but as someone said, you wouldn't want every track to be like "You Are You Are" and "Moral" would you? All in all an interesting collection of songs with some nice lyrics on many of them. Regards, Mark ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 05:02:57 -0600 (CST) From: whip@ix.netcom.com Subject: Numan fan de-lurking-- Tah Dah! To: numan@cs.uwp.edu Hey everybody! I've been reading all of the digests for about a year now and this is the first time I have felt like chipping in. Curtis "Whip" Whipple from Upland CA... 33 yrs old... a Numan playing DJ. I've been a fan since Saturday Night Live in '79. I was blown away by the show at the Palace in Hollywood this last spring! It was a treat to see him live for the first time. (I was too young and my parents wouldn't let me go to a concert when he was here last time around.) I rate it about the best $$ I've ever spent on entertainment. Marilyn Manson was fun to see on stage with him too. What a combo! That SNL appearance (20 years ago... Wow!) when he played "Cars" and "Praying to the Aliens" was so far from anything I had ever seen... My dad even saw it and although he didn't get it, he appreciated the fact that it was new and exciting, he couln't look away either. It did for me what I hear people say about the first time Elvis or the Beatles performed on Ed Sullivan... Well, I was blown away and my life has been forever changed by that 6 or 7 minute exposure to Gary Numan! The fact I make my living as a DJ had it's genesis it that exposure... long story... One other band caught my attention back then too... When I heard the piano on "Come Sail Away" by Styx, It sparked my imagination changed the direction of my life. I'm still a Styx fan too... BTW, they are working on an album this spring with that original line-up from back in 77-83. Last night on Conan O'Brian, I saw a band that had that same spark that I hadn't felt since I saw Gary Numan on SNL. They are called "Orgy". Bands don't always come across very well on TV and that's why alot of them wuss out and just lip sync their songs... I hate that. Well, ORGY kicked butt!! The lead singer looked alot like Gary Numan... the guitarist had a Terri Nunn hairdo and Devo moves... doing a New Order song! Today I bought the disc and checked their website and found that they are Headlining at the Glass House in Pomona CA (about 10 minutes from here..) this week. So I am going to see them live. Then they tour the U.S. opening for Love and Rockets this spring. Although I like Love and Rockets, I think ORGY is gonna blow them off the stage. I just have a hunch, being a Disc Jockey, that Rap and Hip-hop is dying a slow but SURE death... and with the popularity of new bands like ORGY, the stage is set for not only a great disc from our hero, but a commercially sucessful one. Enough rambling... Fave Numan albums: Dance-- Slowcar to China-- Fave Numan song! Telekon-- Joy Circuit is the reason the album is a fave. Replicas-- I was 14 years old and the story connected with me. Pleasure Principle-- Airlane..WHAT A WAY TO BEGIN AN ALBUM!! It was magical. Sacrifice-- I started to loose confidence for several albums, but he got back on track here. Fave non Numan albums: Styx-- The Grand Illusion Boomtown Rats-- Fine art of Surfacing Cheap Trick-- Live a Budokan (I don't like the first half at all, but the 2nd half is so good, that it brings it in to the top) Sting-- Dream of the Blue Turtles Nine Inch Nails-- Pretty Hate Machine Police-- Regatta de Blanc Le Mystere Des Voix Bulgares The Outfield-- First album Crowded House-- First album U2-- Unforgettable Fire They Might be Giants-- Flood Honorable mention-- Saga, Devo, Nitzer Ebb Sorry this is so long... Cut me some slack!! I have kept quiet for a whole year! Curtis Whipple ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 16:47:06 -0800 From: Jeffrey Sopko Subject: Numan Song Books/Tablature To: numan@cs.uwp.edu Was wondering if anyone Numanoids could help me out? I am actively seeking Numan song books, tablature, etc. Originals are great, but photocopies will do. I was speaking with one Numanoid who had listed his songbook for sale here, but I lost contact due to computer crash. Anyway, let me know. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 16:00:25 GMT0BST From: "James Chapman" Subject: What about T-shirts? To: numan@cs.uwp.edu In the last digest, Peter Enright mentioned posters of album covers. I have already agreed with that idea but how about doing T-Shirts? They may have to be done on a white background, so I reckon one of Berserker would be pretty cool. But if you did one of Sacrifice it'd just look like a black square :-) James ------------------------------ End of Gary Numan Digest ****************************** _______________________________________________________________________ _____ ____ ____ _____ _____ / \ | | / \ / \ / \ / \ | |-----| |-----| | |-----| |-----| | | | G | | A | | | R | | Y | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |-----| |-----| | |-----| |-----| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | N | E | W | S |=====| | | | | | | | & | | | | | | | \_____/ I | N | F | O | | | | is produced and distributed by Derek Langsford dlangs@sunstroke.sdsu.edu -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To reply to the messages in this list, mail to: numan@cs.uwp.edu If you want to be removed, or someone wants to be added, you can mail to numan-request@cs.uwp.edu ----------------- The Gary Numan Digest is brought to you via Datta Production and Development, 905 97th Street, Kenosha, WI 53143 USA datta@cs.uwp.edu and computer resources courtesy of University of Wisconsin-Parkside and Datta Production and Development. All of the opinions in this digest belong to the respective authors and do not necessarily agree with those of Datta Production and Development. Datta Production and Development is not affiliated with University Of Wisconsin - Parkside or the University of Wisconsin System. --------------------------------------------------------------------------