Gary Numan Digest Thu, 2 Sep 99 Volume 1 : Issue 569 Today's Topics: "staring at the face of rage" A great night out ! A reply to Danny T's reply to my reply to his miserable post Cars Video in Germany Danny T (For I Believe It Is He) Danny T(wat) how boring one more 'Dance', with different partners Q157 Q157 Not Sad git or what! Searching old video Serious review ... Something positive :-) Video Video ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 14:27:24 -0500 From: Valerie Iglar-Mobley Subject: "staring at the face of rage" To: Danny T Dear Danny T, You wrote in to Digest #568 to go through each person who has written to you... and trash them. I think that's very sad. What were you hoping to accomplish? Did you just want these others to feel hurt? > I originally regretted any offence I may have caused to anyone, > but such has been the level of hatred aimed at me I'm feeling less > regretfull now. What did you think would be the response? You wrote in to the Digest to spout off at great length how awful you think Numan is. You were being deliberately provocative; of course you were going to receive hostility back. Let me draw you an analogy. You mentioned David Sylvian as a musical artist you greatly admire. I personally think he has the most beautiful voice in popular music today, and I think his albums with Japan and his earlier solo albums are exquisite... but this most recent record was a huge disappointment to me. As was 'Rain Tree Crow.' As was 'The First Day.' But if I wrote in to a David Sylvian discussion group to complain at length about how bad I think those albums are and to insult Sylvian the man, I certainly wouldn't be surprised if I was met with hostility in return. > I'm doing nothing other than putting across a point of view. Now you're being evasive. Technically, yes that's all you're doing, but the point of view you're putting across is incendiary. And I don't need to point that out; you knew it before you ever posted your original message. You were looking for a fight. And you got one. To then claim to be a victim of the melee you instigated is intellectual dishonesty of a pretty grand scale. > I'm making a serious point. No, apart from insulting us fans and our hero-- and doing so in purple prose and at great length-- apparently you're not. Your point is that Numan's music is terrible now, that he should change what he's doing and emulate other artists, and that anyone who likes what he's doing now does so only out of blind devotion. And for us to pretend otherwise reveals our idiocy. What are we supposed to learn from this that is so important? What did you hope to accomplish? Should we all hang our heads in shame? If you really want to discuss Numan's music and its merits and the quality of being a Numan fan, I invite you to turn the volume down several decibels and show others the same respect you'd like to be shown. There are a lot of people on this Digest, all dedicated to Numan's music and all capable of joining in a discussion with you. Give it a try. love, Benjamin Iglar-Mobley (proud member of Boys Like Us) * * * "But don't you wonder? And don't you think it's strange? The sacrifice of children? Innocence bleeding..." ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 17:44:27 +0100 From: "DAVID DALTON" Subject: A great night out ! To: "Gary Numan" I can highly recommend a club which played a great deal of Numan tunes. The first time I went down was last Monday. It is called Electric Dreams and is held at Gossips Club in Soho. I will certainly be going again. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 08:32:32 +1000 From: Martin Purvis Subject: A reply to Danny T's reply to my reply to his miserable post To: "'Gary Numan'" >Martin Purvis - "Danny, you may be right about us living in the past. So >what? I'd rather live in the past and be happy than live in the present and >be as miserable as you appear to be." - Why do you assume I'm miserable! Can >I not make constructive criticism and be in a good mood at the same time? >Are you really that profoundly stupid! Does this lack of clarity and >judgement of the human mind explain why you so live in the past? Hilarious! You're the one who says that Gary's early stuff was great and his new stuff is crap. Yet I'm the one who's living in the past? One of us does indeed appear to be profoundly stupid, but at the moment I think it's probably you. I recently went about 2 or 3 months without listening to Exile, as I concentrated on some of the Beggars reissues etc. I only returned to it a few days ago. And what do you know? I still love it. You've accused anyone who dares to say they like the newer stuff of just being a Numan sycophant, but I think that anyone who knows me will agree that I'm not. >I was a massive fan once, but all the loyalty I showed is for nothing, like turning >up to demonstrate against Radio One on his behalf Strange. According to you Gary was already producing utter crap well before the Radio One protest took place. Why would you join a protest to demand that they play crap music? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 08:41:29 +0200 From: "Ingo Weinard" Subject: Cars Video in Germany To: "Gary Numan" -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: numan@cs.uwp.edu An: datta@cs.uwp.edu Datum: Sonntag, 29. August 1999 08:25 Betreff: Gary Numan Digest V1 #568 On August 24. and 31. the Fear Factory - Numan Cars Video was showing on Viva2. A big german Music TV broadcaster. It was in the show 2 Rock on number 11 in the charts! So we hope now it goes higher and higher! The presenter said that Gary is a Electro Pop Legend- so then---- good news or? cu.... Ingo Weinard ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 13:17:37 -0400 From: Matthew Roberts Subject: Danny T (For I Believe It Is He) To: Gary Numan Don't I recall that Danny T's original tirade was a little childish and offensive? Is it unfair then that he chooses eloquence to defend himself?= Maybe, but he does a good job - evidently we've given him plenty of ammunition. Danny believes that Numan post 1983 is rubbish. However, I can still list= en to: The Chemical Brothers dEUS Ben Folds Five New Radicals Shed 7 Kate Bush Supergrass Faith No More all of whom I love, then put Machine & Soul on and think "this is fucking= brilliant". I can think that because there are 2 types of music - music made with feeling, and the sort that Robbie Williams and Britney Spears sing. The first sort is never, ever simply "rubbish". The first sort can touch people. Gary makes the first sort. = In 20 years, I've come across 4 types of people that insist that Gary is simply "rubbish" - soul fans, children, music journalists or ex-Numan fan= s. I'm actually quite glad that the first 2 tend to say that. I'm disappoint= ed that the last 2 tend do, but I understand why they sometimes do. Reputati= on or ego may be at stake. On a cheerier note: Music journalist to Flat Eric: "Aren't you just a brainless puppet of the= corporate pop machine?" Flat Eric: "No, you must be confusing me with Celine Dion." Even the NME has it's good moments. Matthew Roberts ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 20:19:14 +0100 From: "Mark Rider" Subject: Danny T(wat) To: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Danny, Thanks for the long,boring, message. I doubt that there are that many = people on the digest that give a f**k who you are or what you think! =20 TikTokMan: Keep it up, mate! =20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Danny, Thanks for the long,boring, = message. I=20 doubt that there are that many people on the digest that give a f**k who = you are=20 or what you think! TikTokMan: Keep it up, mate! =20 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 08:01:13 -0400 From: "D&T WHEELER" Subject: how boring To: "Numan Digest" Listen, I know that this is only MY opinion, but the latest digests have been full of bitching and cock fighting. I really get tired of the "look at me, I'm so smart with all my knowledge of Numan, the law, and how everyone should live their life" attitude. However, I do feel each IS entitled to their own opinion. Sure, I wish Gary would do some things differently if it would help him become more popular, and mostly if it would help to get more music to my CD player more often. I would even like to hear some tracks played differently, and I have some tracks I love and some I hate. But, all the bitching will not change anyone's mind. Especially Gary's. I think that's why I like him so much... he does what he wants and to hell with the rest. He controls his music so it comes out the way he wants it to, and I like that about him. "Take no shit" a friend of mine always says. Anyhoo, all this rambling is meant to say maybe this digest could use a little more positive canter. And as for a forum to "complain", I think we should do a "Wish List". At the end of your posting, place your "I wish Gary would..." one liner. Maybe this would create a less aggressive way to bitch, and maybe even create a little humour when doing so. Any one willing to try it? Later, Tim "I wish Gary would..." hurry up and get the new songs together for the next CD. My addiction is fading... I need a fix. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 13:11:00 -0500 From: Valerie Iglar-Mobley Subject: one more 'Dance', with different partners To: david c carroll > I haven't gotten this yet but I've read about it here and on the > Beggars Banquet website. Why isn't "Love Needs No Disguise" on it > (as it was on the Japanese Asylum release)? Was it a legal issue? > I'm a bit disappointed. David, I'm guessing it was left off because of time constraints; they just couldn't fit everything that was on the 'Asylum' version and "Face to Face" AND the new track "Dance"... so something had to give. I'm guessing that their thinking was, because "Disguise" wasn't written by Gary, it's the least "Gary" song of the lot. Here's my question, though. Why did they move "Face to Face" from 'Warriors'-- which had so much spare time on that disc that they included two versions of the "E Reg Model" version of "Cars" on it, even with all the b-sides from that album-- to 'Dance', where it bounced out "Love Needs No Disguise"? What are they going to do with all the time they've cleared on the 'Warriors' disc now that they've taken "Letters" off of it? Is some other new material in the pipeline? Anyone have the knowin' on this? Benjamin Iglar-Mobley (proud member of Boys Like Us) * * * "Rearrange thoughts to 'what will be will be'" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 15:17:03 -0400 From: Matthew Roberts Subject: Q157 To: Gary Numan 2 small items from October's Q: Gary appears in their Instant Karma section (together with a recent pic) answering supposedly philosophic questions - seem more pyschoanalytic to me, but I guess most Q readers wouldn't discriminate. Iggy Pop is interviewed. Talking about Bowie's "Berlin" period (i.e. Low/Heroes) he says: "(It was) terrific for a lot of bands that followed. Good for New Order, Bad Seeds, Gary Numan..." Good to know that people are paying attention. Matthew Roberts ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 17:20:04 -0400 From: Matthew Roberts Subject: Q157 Not To: Gary Numan Should have mentioned another coupla semi-Numan references in the previou= s post, this time from September's Rock Sound (crap magazine, EXCELLENT fre= e CD each month - they introduced me to the devine dEUS.) The new single by Add N To (X) is described thus: "Deeply unnerving.. Renegade Soundwave with strings and, disturbingly, Ga= ry Numan's synth." An even more tenous item - in an article on industrial music, Project Pitchfork are described as (I kid you not): "Darkwave electro replete with echoed guitars, distorted vocals, breakbea= ts and massive choruses, the profoundly cool Project Pitchfork sound somethi= ng like DM gone all industrial then inviting Trent Reznor over to fuck aroun= d. Their last two releases Chakra Red and Eon Eon are two of the most inspir= ed goth-industrial albums ever and PP deserve to be huge." Made me revisit the I Live Your Dream single, and yes, they're actually O= K, although they'd be a lot better if they sung in German. Spahn Ranch are also praised (remember "The Mix" - I can't be bothered to= revist that.) Can anyone either confirm or deny these Rock Sound eulogies? Matthew Roberts ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 15:12:45 BST From: "James Chapman" Subject: Sad git or what! To: numan@cs.uwp.edu I ain't going to bother responding to every point Mr Sad (aka Danny T) has raised except his reply to Riana about what she said. >SomaCrow - "Hello, Danny. Provocation on the Digest is the job of James >Chapman and Nick Fox. Really. They have fancy embossed business cards to >prove it. Don't step on their turf." - I couldn't give a stuff about those >two, I'm making a serious point, not looking for cheap thrills. > I do not look for cheap thrills, thank you very much Danny. I make a serious point as well, except I don't go personally attacking people for things they like. The provocation Riana was referring to was a bit of banter about Strange Charm, which I absolutely love, to another guy who makes a big thing out of hating it, I just have to exploit it :-). Even he seems to like the rest of Numan's work. I like most of Gary's work, even 1984 onwards. It may not be the most advanced stuff but it gives me more satisfaction listening to it than more advanced stuff does. Getting personal to people about things they like is the lowest of lows, in my opinion. Is there any way of editing this kind of spam from the digest? Derek? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 10:20:50 -0300 From: "97FM" <97fm@colatina.com.br> Subject: Searching old video To: "Gary Numan" Hi, NUMANoids !! I want the old video called "Touring Principle" (1979) In VHS If you can help me, please, contact me privately. I have for trade the CDs "Exile" and "Remixes" by Gary Numan. Thanks Eduardo ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 17:56:46 +0400 From: "The Tik Tok Man" Subject: Serious review ... To: "Numan Digest" Just sitting down with a coffee and quietly perusing issue #2 of Alien, the official Numan mag. For those of you who haven't read it, I offer the following excerpt from a series on the early days of the Tubeway Army, which is cleverly presented as a series of quotes from those involved. Mick Wall of Sounds reviewed an early performance at Dingwall's. Expecting a serious review of their music I read the following: "In Valeriun (vocals, guitar) they have going for them what undoubtedly is their strongest visual asset. Blond-haired, blue-eyed visage that promises to dampen the knickers of many a sweet young thing once given the right kind of exposure." >spitting coffee sound< What? So, it wasn't the music after all ... Given this new insight, the question is: so girls, does he still possess this mysterious "dampening" effect then? And here's another gem. Visualise this quote from Jess Lidyard, "Rehearsals were always pretty basic. We'd go to his parents and even by the time of Replicas it would still be Gary on this very old, out-of-tune piano with some of the keys missing." What a major talent. TikTokMan Moscow Proud member of the Non-Critical Digesters Splinter Group. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 09:52:43 BST From: "James Chapman" Subject: Something positive :-) To: numan@cs.uwp.edu Michael J. Damrath wrote: > All I could come up with is this: I recently compiled my "Desert >Island Disc" of all of >the Numan tracks that I can't live without (that will fit on one 75 minute >CD). I burned this >compilation to disc and even created my own personalized booklet and >cover-art. It's called >(how original) "The Best of Gary Numan: The Mike Damrath Mix". Here's the >track order: > >1. "Interval 1" - Outland >2. "The Angel Wars" - Exile >3. "I Die: You Die" - Telekon >4. "Love and Napalm" - Sacrifice >5. "We Need It" - The Fury (B-Side) >6. "Dominion Day" - Exile >7. "The Image Is" - I, Assassin (B-Side) >8. "America" - Metal Rhythm >9. "It Must Have Been Years" - Replicas >10. "A Question of Faith" - Sacrifice >11. "Moral" - Dance >12. "Interval 2" - Outland >13. "From Russia Infected" - Outland >14. "Interval 3" - Outland >15. "War Songs" - I, Assassin >16. "Dark" - Exile > > My only regret is that I had to cut it off at 75 minutes. I would have >liked to have >added "The God Film", "Warriors", "Friends", and a dozen more - but I had >to stop somewhere I >suppose. > That's all for now. I now return you to your regularly scheduled >dispondency. Some good choices there, Mike. I reckon I'll do the same but instead I'll do a 4 CD boxed set version :-) Disc 1: The James Chapman singles collection: 1. I Die: You Die 2. We Take Mystery 3. Cars E Reg Model 4. Berserker 5. AFE 6. I Can't Stop 7. America 8. Your Fascination 9. New Thing From London Town 10. Music For Chameleons Disc 2: The album tracks collection: 1. Metal 2. Strange Charm 3. I'm An Agent 4. Hunger 5. My Breathing 6. Love And Napalm 7. Bleed 8. Tricks 9. Cold Warning 10. Airlane Disc 3: The B-sides/outtakes collection: 1. I Don't Believe 2. We Have a Technical 3. Noise Noise 4. Here Am I 5. We Need It 6. In A Glasshouse 7. Shame 8. Metal Beat 9. This House Is Cold 10. Faces Possible bonus track: Dance (when I get to hear it) :-) Disc 4: The extended mixes: 1. I Can't Stop 10" club mix 2. We Take Mystery 12" 3. Berserker 4. The Angel Wars 5. An Alien Cure 6. Deadliner 7. New Thing From London Town 12" 8. My Dying Machine Italian remix 9. A Question of Faith 10. Machine and Soul (mix 4 off the CD5 part 2) :-) There we go, that was rather difficult :-) I wonder what Danny T thinks of that (ie a lot of the tracks are post 1983)? I'll expect my flaming around Christmas :-) Cheers, James ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 12:41:36 -0500 (CDT) From: jkuchink@ix.netcom.com Subject: Video Video To: numan@cs.uwp.edu Hi, This is my first post to the list. I was wondering if the video of 'Shadowman' is any good? Sixteen pounds is a lot of money... I had a video of the Berserker tour and the quality was horrible. Maybe that happens when converting PAL to NTSC. I guess someone was doing a bit of cleaning when they found a crate of old NUMA cassettes. Five pounds is reasonable for 'Numa Records Year 1'. You'll never find that anywhere. I know Gary has to make a living, but why are all the items priced so high? I buy from yalplay.com much cheaper, but they don't have the videos. Anyone who is buying their imports from cdnow must have lots 'o' loot... I just ordered 'Metal Rhythm' and 'The Skin Mechanic' for 18.24(pounds) total from yalplay. Why no 'Outland'? maybe it's a horrible album? I don't want to start any arguements, but we all know what the bad albums are. (most of the live ones) Why are all of you so obsessed with all of the bootleg concerts? Most of them are crap recordings. 'Time To Die Live' comes to mind...or was that just a horrible performance? 'Replicas' was a great album twenty years ago (I still have my vinyl copy), but some of you need to move on... I'm sure I pissed off enough of you for now. Cheers, Billy p.s. Some of you might want to use a little thing called spell check. Thanks... ------------------------------ End of Gary Numan Digest ****************************** _______________________________________________________________________ _____ ____ ____ _____ _____ / \ | | / \ / \ / \ / \ | |-----| |-----| | |-----| |-----| | | | G | | A | | | R | | Y | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |-----| |-----| | |-----| |-----| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | N | E | W | S |=====| | | | | | | | & | | | | | | | \_____/ I | N | F | O | | | | is produced and distributed by Derek Langsford dlangs@sunstroke.sdsu.edu -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To reply to the messages in this list, mail to: numan@cs.uwp.edu If you want to be removed, or someone wants to be added, you can mail to numan-request@cs.uwp.edu ----------------- The Gary Numan Digest is brought to you via Datta Production and Development, 905 97th Street, Kenosha, WI 53143 USA datta@cs.uwp.edu and computer resources courtesy of University of Wisconsin-Parkside and Datta Production and Development. 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