Gary Numan Digest Sun, 12 Dec 99 Volume 1 : Issue 598 Today's Topics: (sans sujet) Gary Numan Digest V1 #597 Miscellaneous drivel (hadda give Valerium some ammo) MP3s on the Usenet North American Gary Numan Fan Club Numan on Saturday Night Live Rare Numan for Christmas???? Tom Binns Show - Paddy Vickers VIDEOS / THE PLAN Reissue Your name is actually "Valerium"?!? ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 16:39:38 EST From: Tetouille@aol.com Subject: (sans sujet) To: numan@cs.uwp.edu je voudrai me procurer le dernier album de gary comment faire y a t il=20 un distributeur fran=E7ais car je ne parle pas anglais aimerai avoir une=20 r=E9ponse=20 rapide c est pour faire un cadeau de No=EBl a un tr=E8s bon copain en vous remerciant par avance=20 =20 amicalement ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 16:00:48 -0600 From: JASON ORTON Subject: To: (null) MY NAME IS JASON. I AM FAIRLY NEW TO THE NUMAN EXPERIENCE. OTHER THEN "CARS", WHICH I LISTENED TO IN JR. HIGH, I DIDN'T KNOW MUCH ABOUT GARY NUMAN. I JUST RECENTLY RE-DISCOVERED HIM, STRANGELY ENOUGH, AT A COMIC BOOK STORE. I AM A BIG FAN OF THE "DAWN" SERIES OF COMICS. GARY NUMAN DID A SOUNDTRACK TO THE SERIES A FEW YEARS AGO. AFTER THAT I WENT OUT AND STARTED TO PICK UP HIS OTHER WORKS. AS FAR AS OTHER MUSIC I LISTEN TO, I'M OPEN TO ANY TYPE OF MUSIC (EXCEPT COUNTRY). MY MUSIC COLLECTION CONSISTS OF EVERYTHING FROM "PINK FLOYD" TO "THEATER OF TRAGEDY". I ALSO HAVE SOME JAZZ BY PATRICIA BARBER, AND SOME CLASSICAL CD'S BY SOME OF THE GREAT COMPOSERS. AS FAR AS FAVORITE ARTISTS GO, OTHER THEN GARY NUMAN, I LOVE A LOT OF THE RECENT GOTHIC STUFF. "LONDON AFTER MIDNIGHT" AND "SWITCHBLADE SYMPHONY" ARE SOME OF MY FAVORITE BANDS. THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME JOIN YOUR GROUP, AND I LOOK FORWARD TO LEARNING MORE ABOUT GARY NUMAM. JASON ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 22:05:13 -0000 From: "Sarah" Subject: Gary Numan Digest V1 #597 To: "NUMAN Digest" Hi Guys, I have a confession: I'm not reading much of the Digest at the moment. I have a couple of excuses - I'm in the middle of moving house, for one. And, erm, well, some of you are a bit... erm, OTT, anally retentive and all that.... (woohoo - that's going to really wind some of you up!!! ) This Digest isn't a Shrine to Gary Numan.. I thought it was a discussion forum - you know, as in "a place where all our opinions are valid for a myriad of reasons". I adore Numan, and his music.... but I realise that at the end of the day, he's still wonderfully human, imperfect and as prone to mistakes and blunders and hiccups as we all are. And whilst you're all bitching at each other, and trashing each others opinions - I can't help but wonder if you might all be missing the point: how can we best support Numes and therefore encourage him to keep making music, to keep putting out CD's and albums, to keep going when the rest of the industry still prefers to try and dismiss him. I still think it is outrageous that when we've had to suffer all the pomp and stomp and stamp of celebrating various artists being in the industry for 5 minutes (Spice Girls) or 20 or 30 years in the industry (Rolling Stones, Sir Cliff Richard, Elton John, Status Quo, etc etc) - no-one has recognised in any serious medium the contribution Gary Numan has made in the last 20 or so years. Personally, I believe the man is a genius. All the best Sarah ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Dec 1999 19:02:51 -0700 From: "Joey Lindstrom" Subject: Miscellaneous drivel (hadda give Valerium some ammo) To: "Gary Numan" >From Jon Glass: >btw: does anyone know if numan was on saturday night live, if so what year & >what songs? i gotta track it down. did anyone catch beck last night on snl? >hes so awesome! ok, im leaving now. 1980 if I recall correctly, mighta been 1979 though. He played "Cars" and "Praying To The Aliens". I remember watching it the night it aired but haven't seen it since. Martin Purvis wrote: >I've received computerised junk mail addressed to "Martian Purvis" and >"Martin Pelvis". If I ever receive junk mail addressed to "Martian Pelvis" >I will open it and buy the product. Well, at least you'd know it was for you. :-) Valerium/Valerian/whatever spewed forth: >Firstly, you are not the reason Gary "exploded" all over his website . Don't >flatter yerself mate. (P.S. Call that an explosion. More like a whimper!) You are one stupid, stupid man. Here's what I wrote, to which you're specifically responding: "Oh. I see. So in fact, *I* am the problem and *I* am the reason Gary chose to explode all over his website. Ah, it all makes sense to me now..." This, shit-for-brains, is what anyone with a fourth-grade-or-better education calls "sarcasm". Have a quick visit to http://www.dictionary.com and type in that word. It'll be an eye-opening experience for you, I'm sure. >Secondly, you may recall that my initial email was in fact to wish you well >in your move and to hope that you got you network challenges sorted after I >saved you some 600 bucks as you were seemingly about to spend a huge amount >of your cash on an overpriced switch. Your busy mailbox is unlikely to be >overflowing with my missives due to your incredulous archiving system >however, you may recall that you started the shit with that wondrous >egotistical reply (Or was that me misconstruing?) Well, you weren't really misconstruing anything. Your wish of goodwill was anything *BUT* that, although you've insisted that *I* misconstrued. It was a hateful piece of text and you got the reply you deserved. As to the switch, I found one for $275CAD (about $200USD). 8 ports, no waiting. >When I stated people do not give a toss, it was not the topic to which I was >referring but to you inane ramblings. Apologies for lack of clarity. (Or was >that you misconstruing?) No, I understood that part quite clearly - for once, your text was less turgid than usual (there's another word you can look up at dictionary.com). While this is not a popularity contest, I'd be willing to bet that my postings here generate more email (and more in-Digest replies) than yours do. Thus, your statement that "nobody" gives a toss about what I write is completely absurd on the face of it. This is not to say that I consider myself "better" than anyone else here (well, except maybe for you, zipperhead). It's just that statements such as this demand a response. And I have responded. I'm guessing you weren't too happy with that response... >Thirdly, I care not a jot what GN thinks of me. Not interested in the >slightest. I would love to see him try to pound my face. Now that would be >fun. He better bring some friends. I don't have anything specific to say about this. I just thought it was so funny, and so indicative of the mindset you operate from, that it bore repeating. >Fourthly (Is that a word?), I post negative reviews when negative reviews >require to be posted. Never ANON always up front. If I was always ANON then >this would be. Facts wrong again Joey (Someone pick me up.) I also post >positive reviews, the most recent being from the SB show Sept 1998, and many >many others. Rob may indeed still have that review in the tours section. Hey >go look. Is it ANON? No its me. Shock horror. Someone might find me out. Another clear example of nearly *EVERYTHING* you say being completely absurd on the face of it. But let's take the logical approach, shall we? You state that you post your negative reviews "Never ANON always up front" and later ask "Is it ANON? No its me" (sic). So lemme ask this question. WHO THE FUCK *ARE* YOU? When do you *EVER* post using your real name? When I post here, I use my real name: "Joey Lindstrom". I don't have a problem with you using an alias to post, but do *NOT* do so and then tell me you don't post anonymously. >I ain't scared of no-one and ain't interested if I piss anyone off. Life is >too short to sit on the fence. I'll bet you'd have loved to have been a part of the riots at Seattle or Euston Station, too... it would seem to fit your worldview. >I have been here since the beginning. I am entitled to state my view >positive and negative, even if I had not been. Absolutely true. But have the balls to stand behind what you say, without hiding behind an alias. >So you see I ain't one of the same ol whingers. In fact I have been praising >GN for 19 years and "whinging" for the last three gigs. Not a bad proportion >I fear. You've been "whinging" longer than that, both here and on the UBB. >Gary Numan despises me. Chew on that. Sorry, but I have more important >things to do, like go clear up the dog shit again. Ok Coming dear! The defence rests. Jeff Tolva mercifully changed the subject with this: >I just wanted to let everyone know that one of the most (if not THE most) >comprehensive online Gary Numan discographies has been updated following >the recent Manchester gig in November. The "compleat discography" can be >viewed both through The World Wide Webb as well as The Gary Numan Fan Server. And also http://discography.GaryNumanFan.NU And I'll get that revision-date thing you asked for fixed soon, promise! :-) Chris Munroe added: >part of being a fan is giving what you perceive as constructive criticism >when you feel it's needed. the people who express issues that they have with >concerts or albums are just as much fans as those who mindlessly gush on and >on about the (admittedly superior) quality of an artists output. you are >doing gary no favours by trying to quash any criticism by branding those who >criticize as less than "true fans", as if you totally remove the criticism >from an artist, however talented, an artist stops putting effort into his >work. remember, this is the same attitude that led david bowie to release >tin machine albums. Nobody's saying we can't criticize Gary Numan. What we're calling into question is the manner in which some people do so (ie: comments about Gary's "silly" hairstyles and whatnot) and the fact that some people seem bent on focusing solely on the negative and not giving him credit for the positive. There's no "balance", and with the exception of shit-for... er, I mean Valerium, most of the time people are writing things that they would never say to Gary Numan face to face. If I met Gary today, and he asked me what I thought of the three shows I saw on the North American tour last year, I'd tell him all sorts of praiseful things about Seattle and San Francisco (although the sound levels were a little shaky at the latter venue), but I'd bring up some negatives about the Vancouver show. That venue was god-awful, the sound was terrible, and the crowd seemed more interested in drinking beer than in watching Gary play - and all of this, in my opinion, affected Gary's performance. If you're up there doin' your thing and you know the crowd's not into it, how can you POSSIBLY be motivated to give your best effort? When I saw him the very next night in Seattle, it was like a totally different show - everybody, Gary and everyone in the band, was much more into it and the performance was much, much better. They rocked the house down and the crowds outside the show afterwards were RAVING about how good it was. I can say to Gary's face that his performance in Vancouver wasn't as good as it might have been, and with luck he might even agree with my assessment. But these are words I could stand behind. But I couldn't stand behind something like "that weird trenchcoat or whatever it was he was wearin' looked stupid". I couldn't LOOK HIM IN THE EYES and tell him that - I have too much respect for him. I might, however, find another way to say the same thing, a way that respects his feelings a bit more. As somebody else in the last issue (sorry, I deleted your text or I'd give you credit) said, Gary's an artist who's managed to touch many of us very deeply and in a profound way. I could never be that cruel to him, and I fail utterly to understand how anybody who calls themselves a "fan" could do so. I'm not advocating an only-positive, kid-gloves approach - but I do say that there's a right way and a wrong way to criticize. Matthew Roberts checks in with: >Joey, I'm surprised to hear you quoting Mr Heinlein. I've only read "The >Moon Is A Harsh Mistress" and it was the worst type of space-opera garbag= >e >I had the misfortune to read until I was suckered into Berserker Planet. >Wasn't dear old Robert a nasty old-school right-right-winger? Unless the >plot for Starship Troopers was really just a joke... I wasn't actually defending Heinlein (read again and note my strategic use of a smiley), but as you expect me to do so, I shall. He is, after all, my all-time favourite author (one of his stories, "The Roads Must Roll", was an early Numan influence). It's rather interesting that you chose those two books to compare (although I'm guessing you're referring to the AWFUL movie version of Troopers). Robert Heinlein won four Hugo Awards in his lifetime (awarded by his peers for the best sci-fi book of that year), and these two books account for half of that total (the others being "Double Star" and "Stranger In A Strange Land"). What exactly turned you off of Mistress? Personally, it's my fave Heinlein book. I didn't find it terribly right-wing... ok, it was right-wing, but not nearly so much as Troopers, which was almost a religious tract by comparison. Heinlein's real-life beliefs have been described as "slightly-right-of-centre", so don't make the mistake of confusing his characters with the writer, any more than we should confuse Gary Numan's characters with the man himself. I invite you to check out "Stranger In A Strange Land" for a story with a leftist slant. Also, "Double Star" is interesting in that the lead character, who literally has to spend some time in another man's shoes, comes to the realization that just because another man holds fundamentally opposite views from you doesn't mean he's not worthy of respect and even admiration. This is something we should all strive for. >"Common sense" CAN be an oxymoron in certain contexts, but as a >generalisation Heinlein's view can be used to support any philosophy you >like. For example, my common sense tells me there will always be people i= >n >society needing (and deserving) welfare. Ayn Rand might reply that my >common sense is an oxymoron and those slackers just need a giant shot of >'laissez faire' up the arse. I was surfin' the internet the other day and came across a column by Camille Paglia (a Democrat), I believe on salon.com. I can't quote her exactly, but she basically states that the free market system we have, despite what the left would have you believe, is *THE* reason that women and minorities are more "equal" today than ever before in history. Granted, they still have not achieved complete equality but SIGNIFICANT strides have been made over the last hundred or so years, and the momentum is pushing us further towards that goal. Women and minorities today have far, far more economic power than ever before, and *THAT* is the enabler. She goes on, however, to state that while capitalism needs to be as unfettered as possible, a just society will always watch out for the needs of those at the bottom, of those who slip through the cracks. And I agree completely, and I think Robert Heinlein would too if he were alive today. Where we (you and I) will likely differ is on the definition of who exactly "deserves" welfare. I don't think a man who would rather sit on his couch and watch football rather than work for a living "deserves" welfare. But someone with a mental illness who is unable to work probably does. In Heinlein's book "Farmer In The Sky", one fellow decides that he's been ripped off by "the government", which has plunked him and his family down on the surface of Ganymede and given him BARELY enough in terms of tools and supplies to prove himself a farm on the newly-terraformed Jovian satellite. He declares that he won't participate, that he'll just sit on his ass until the next transport for Earth is ready to leave, and that he and his family will return aboard it. When asked how he'll support himself until then, he smiles and says the government can feed him. The questioner responds, after a moment: "well, we won't let your family starve, but you can eat vacuum for all I care" (or words to that effect). That line, I think, sums this whole thing up rather well. If you flat out refuse to look after yourself, and don't have a valid excuse for it, then you deserve what you get. / From the messy desktop of Joey Lindstrom / Visit The NuServer! http://www.GaryNumanFan.NU / Visit The Webb! http://webb.GaryNumanFan.NU / / Widows are far better than brides. They don't tell, they won't yell, / they don't swell, they rarely smell, and they're grateful as hell. / -- Ira Johnson, "To Sail Beyond The Sunset" / (Robert Heinlein) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 15:53:42 -0700 From: "Chris Devine" Subject: MP3s on the Usenet To: And I quote: I have to admit though, I now believe all music should be free. I'm sick of the attitude that "I got into music to get rich and get chicks". If that's the case these people should become real estate agents or lawyers. Keep music free. And I reply: ... I admit that, as a practicing musician and sometime recording artist, I've got to take exception to this. Strenuously. I certainly did not go into music to "get rich and get chicks." But neither can I do music if I can't make expenses back, an attitude I'm sure Gary can understand, since he's expressed similar sentiments regarding his stuff popping up on the Internet. Music does not appear by magic, and neither is it effortless or free to produce. My band's first album cost $3,000 to record and almost as much to manufacture. Since this was a completely DIY effort, I and my bandmates saved up our own money, paid the fees out of our own pockets, and have proceeded to make back at least a chunk of it (since a large number of copies have gone to promotional purposes, we knew we weren't going to break even on it). Frankly, I don't expect to donate $5,000 to the music-listening public everytime I want them to hear my music. That's not sensible. How many of us would be willing to go out and buy a car, then leave it on a street corner for general use because, hey, we should "keep transportation free?" I do think that most of the majors over-price and try to soak the public for as much money as they can get, but even they put money into recording, manufacturing, promotion, etc. Should they not expect to make any of that back? If all recorded music were free, then only hobbyists and the independently wealthy would be willing or able to record music; it would be impossible to make a living as a recording artist. I, for one, think that we'd suffer as an audience if our choices were thus reduced. (lest you think I have anything against hobbyist-musicians, one of my favorite all-time "bands" is Negativland, and as far as I know they've never been able to rely solely on their income as a recording or performing entity) I'd love to be able to release my music for free, because what interests me is NOT the money, but that I find an audience I can communicate with. But unless I find a wealthy benefactor who expects no return on his or her investment, I can't do that. And the sooner we make back expenses, the sooner we can record again. Just a thought. Or a rant. I dunno; the lithium hasn't kicked in yet. Chris Devine ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Dec 1999 22:23:53 -0800 (PST) From: PolareBear Subject: North American Gary Numan Fan Club To: numan@cs.uwp.edu Greetings and props to the Numanoids of the World! Jim "The Machman" Napier at your service here to shamelessly plug the World's Longest Running Numanoid Fan Service. I'm speaking about the NAGNFC! If ya haven't stopped by in awhile, stop by the Numan party and check out the web's biggest selection of realaudio downloads, the internet's largest database of Numan websites on the NAGNFC links page, brand new exclusive Numan pics to gaze upon, goodies to win with several lucky (unlucky?) winners every month and gobs upon tons of surprises. http://themachman.garynumanfan.nu The NAGNFC is also your one stop shop for news about the upcoming CD The Church Of Gary Numan: A Dark Celebration. While you download MP3's from that CD, read an exclusive interview with the creator of this high-production value masterpiece which is our hemisphere's answer to Random. For the bartering of Numan items, stop by the WWW's largest potential Numanoid audience outside of EBay to place your free ad. Kick it live with other Numanoids with live chat in the chat room or read the guestbook full of scathing controversial commentary from Numanoids Worldwide about the Website. Gee, the NAGNFC sure has come a long way from that monthly paper fanzine issued back in those steam-driven, vacuum tube, pre-internet days! Cheers to the Numanoid brothers and sisters! Jim "The Machman" Napier NAGNFC http://themachman.garynumanfan.nu _______________________________________________________ Get FREE voicemail, fax and email at http://voicemail.excite.com Talk online at http://voicechat.excite.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 05:56:45 -0500 From: "Ken Bryant" Subject: Numan on Saturday Night Live To: "Numan Digest" Hello all! In #597 "jon glass" wrote: >btw: does anyone know if Numan was on Saturday night live, if so what year & >what songs? I gotta track it down. did anyone catch beck last night on snl? >hes so awesome! ok, im leaving now. Gary was on Saturday Night Live in either 1979 or 1980. I saw him perform "Praying to the Aliens", but that's all. Sadly, I didn't see the entire episode. Comedy Central reruns old episodes of SNL. I say we bombard them with email asking them to air that episode with Numan! Send your Numan request to . They'll get it. Most NBC stations rerun old SNL's after the new episodes are over. There's a good chance of catching it there, because they show *old* episodes. Anywho, if anyone has a copy, let me know too! Bye, Ken "The Numaniac" Bryant ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 03:50:13 -0800 From: "stevorama" Subject: Rare Numan for Christmas???? To: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi folks.... Checking in to let you know I'm auctioning off a couple of perennial = Numan favorites on E-Bay: a copy of his 1982 biography by Ray Coleman = and a copy of the AUTOMATIC CD!!!!!! Book: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3D218339794 CD: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3D218340455 Just so ya know.... Happy holidays! Steve in Florida Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi folks.... Checking in to let you know I'm = auctioning off a=20 couple of perennial Numan favorites on E-Bay: a copy of his 1982 = biography by=20 Ray Coleman and a copy of the AUTOMATIC CD!!!!!! Book: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3D21833= 9794 CD: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3D21834= 0455 Just so ya know.... Happy holidays! Steve in Florida ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Dec 1999 02:49:12 PST From: "ian blair" Subject: Tom Binns Show - Paddy Vickers To: numan@cs.uwp.edu Last Digest - Paddy Vickers asked about the Tomm Binns show: "And where was Dave Brooker?" You clearly mean Dave Brooks... he was unable to attend that night as his his own/other band had a gig. I understand they are called 'Car Wash'??? - Ian ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 11:13:46 EST From: HateGrape@aol.com Subject: VIDEOS / THE PLAN Reissue To: numan@cs.uwp.edu Numanoids; Recently in the Numan Digest I learned that there were loads of Numan videos that I never knew existed. I own the Touring Principle video and have seen the Berserker concert vid (as well as Gary's appearance in URGH! A music war), but have never seen a video other than Cars. Does anyone have a Numan vid-comp (or even a few Numan videos) on USA-compatible VHS tape? Name your price! Please help your fellow Numanoid! Also, the re (or should I say re-reissue) of THE PLAN is amazing. I can't get enough of Gary's voice yelping over the heavy, fast, and loud 70s style lost punk anthems. The man simply rules. -Nick (aka HateGrape@aol.com aka Nick The Yak@aol.com) PS--For all of you MORONS who thought Gary's show in NY in May of l998 sucked, your ears must have been clogged from the opening act or something. The show was perfect. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Dec 1999 11:15:07 -0500 From: "Michael J. Damrath" Subject: Your name is actually "Valerium"?!? To: Gary Numan > > Fourthly (Is that a word?), I post negative reviews when negative reviews > require to be posted. Never ANON always up front. If I was always ANON then > this would be. Facts wrong again Joey (Someone pick me up.) I also post > positive reviews, the most recent being from the SB show Sept 1998, and many > many others. Rob may indeed still have that review in the tours section. Hey > go look. Is it ANON? No its me. Shock horror. Someone might find me out. > Shit > Are you trying to tell us that your parents actually named you "Valerium"? How unusual... -- Mike Damrath Technical Projects Manager/Webmaster Riddick Corporate Marketing, Inc. http://home.earthlink.net/~damrat email addresses: damrat@earthlink.net webmaster@riddickinc.com miked@carrottopdesigns.com ------------------------------ End of Gary Numan Digest ****************************** _______________________________________________________________________ _____ ____ ____ _____ _____ / \ | | / \ / \ / \ / \ | |-----| |-----| | |-----| |-----| | | | G | | A | | | R | | Y | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |-----| |-----| | |-----| |-----| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | N | E | W | S |=====| | | | | | | | & | | | | | | | \_____/ I | N | F | O | | | | is produced and distributed by Derek Langsford dlangs@sunstroke.sdsu.edu -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To reply to the messages in this list, mail to: numan@cs.uwp.edu If you want to be removed, or someone wants to be added, you can mail to numan-request@cs.uwp.edu ----------------- The Gary Numan Digest is brought to you via Datta Production and Development, 905 97th Street, Kenosha, WI 53143 USA datta@cs.uwp.edu and computer resources courtesy of University of Wisconsin-Parkside and Datta Production and Development. 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