Gary Numan Digest Sun, 19 Nov 2000 Volume 2 : Issue 92 Today's Topics: Afrika Bambaata Emperor's New Clothes Gary Numan Digest V2 #91 (2 msgs) good point, replica79 Hmmm..... How cold is Pure? PURE the Album Radio Numan thank you, marilyn ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 14:40:12 +0000 From: Dryad Subject: Afrika Bambaata To: digest@garynumanfan.nu (Gary Numan) Afrika Bambaata and Gary Numan. On the same track. If y'all could see me now, you'd see a very quizzical expression on my face because, well, Afrika Bambaata and Gary Numan - the mind kind of boggles, doesn't it? Who's next, Celine Dion? Clea, boggling ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 13:06:30 GMT From: "Alan Spurr" Subject: Emperor's New Clothes To: digest@GaryNumanFan.NU As this is my first posting to the Digest I don't want to be too controversial, but I think we need to have something of a reality check regarding the state of Gary's career. i) PURE - sales - the album generated the best reviews of Gary's career, and yet, despite this and all the other favourable press Gary's received recently, plus Koochy, Random & other positive things, it only charted for one week, at no. 58! That's a dire showing in anyone's books, and not even as good as Machine+Soul, generally regarded as Gary's career low point. So who bought it? It strikes me it's just the same set of over 30s and over 40s as usual, and evidence of a significance number of new fans buying it is minimal. ii) PURE - style - like Replica79 said in the last Digest, Gary's gone all Marilyn Manson on us, a big retrograde step in my view. 'Goth' is laughable here in the UK, and Gary will remain a figure of fun for some if he imitates Manson. iii) PURE - lyrics - Gary's God obsession has spread over three albums now, even though he did state that there were only going to be 2 or 3 songs devoted to it this time. Is anyone else getting bored with this subject or is it just me? iv) Brixton - the gig was a long long way from being a sell out, attracted a large number of the same over 30s and over 40s as usual and didn't get reviewed at all, anywhere, to my knowledge. To get no reviews at all is a real disaster for Gary, and a real shame, but it underlines the main point of this email - that some Numan fans need a reality check here. I'm not sure Gary's career is going anywhere much at all, despite what some may wish to believe. It's like the Emperor's new clothes - we just see what we want to see, whatever the reality. Alan _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 13:42:42 -0800 (PST) From: Ronald Cole Subject: Gary Numan Digest V2 #91 To: digest@garynumanfan.nu (Gary Numan) Replica79@aol.com writes: >I've been a Numan fan since 1980 (I was nine years old when "Cars" >first hit the U.S. charts) and I have to say that this is his most >uninteresting album since "Exile". Guess I'm an old fuddy-duddy, too, because I feel the same way (except that I was 17 when I first heard "Cars"). "Sacrifice" was a good album, but "Exile" failed for me. "Pure" sounds to me like a blend of "Exile" and "Machine & Soul", with the last track taking on a "Fury" sound. I listened to it several times, now, but can't get past the Bitterness. Guess I just miss the pain of Loneliness, Angst, and Unrequited Love in his songs that I used to identify with. I liked "Pleasure Principle", "Telekon" and "I, Assassin" a lot, but think "Dance" is still his best work. >I know that a great deal of you really like the direction he's been >going in the last few years, I just think its very boring and >extremely derivative. I can't imagine how anyone who owns his earlier >material could consider this his best work. He was an innovator of the >electronic music revolution and has all but turned his back on "his" >style so he can sound like Marilyn Manson. I don't get it. I call it >the Bowie syndrome where an important artist influences a whole new >crop of successful musicians and rather than continue on with what >they do best they try to emulate what their followers are doing. People change, and when they do, their music changes, too. I'll continue to buy Gary's output to support him, but I hope he doesn't think that that means I like the direction he's been going (I can't stand Marilyn Manson and only like a couple of NIN songs). Gary should just go back to being Gary. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 18:37:48 EST From: Numaniac@aol.com Subject: Gary Numan Digest V2 #91 To: digest@garynumanfan.nu In a message dated 11/16/00 3:42:55 AM Pacific Standard Time, digest@garynumanfan.nu writes: << PURE >> oh yeah, by the way people; i got 2 of my other friends to buy the album, this is their first numan album for them. they both describe it as "unlike anything i've ever heard before", and "it's hella' cool". there you have it. that's how good this shit is :) John ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 09:32:41 -0800 From: alecw Subject: good point, replica79 To: digest@garynumanfan.nu Replica79 said: > > > > > I love the music of Gary Numan and in my opinion an artist is always as good > as their best work, I just don't think anyone who owns a copy of "Telekon" > could call this his best album. I miss the innovator... > > Anyway... I'm sorry if this upsets anyone I'm not criticizing your taste in > music I'm just disapointed in Gary becoming a Heavy Metal musician... > i can't help but agree here. the thing i'm realizing is this. look at the first couple of gary numan records and you'll hear a lot of foxx-lead ultravox there. he knew punk was an all-consuming trend that he could find his way into the machine with and he treated it as such. he brought burroughs, philip k. dick, kraftwerk and ultravox to the masses. he even said so. with ultravox, gary transmuted it, shape-shifted it into something entirely his own. just like beck, NIN and others have done with numan himself. none of these things have ever mattered to "our gary". in fact, i remember interview after interview where he characterised himself as little more than a music fan with a keen ear for reconfiguring sounds, riffs and grooves. i never bought that because it just isn't so, of course--not entirely, anyway. i always felt depeche mode was a direct numan rip-off, a multi-headed numan vampire. numan says they're his favorite band!!! he doesn't see it the way many of us do. he just doesn't. it works for him, you know? his later albums sounded a whole lot like kraftwerk and i didn't even notice it because the overall feel was so different. now, there's this marilyn manson, NIN, indust rock, goth business and maybe he's found this whole misappropriated catholic imagery thing just too powerful to ignore, maybe he feels he's been there all along. it's his inspiration at the moment. unlike ultravox or kraftwerk, whatever they were (techno pop? robot rock?) it deals in the obvious, the heavy-handed, the in-your-face set...like punk. it's like punk was his area of entrance in the late '70s. he ignored house, techno, etc. in the late '80s and found inspiration in guitar-driven goth rock in the late '90s. i guess it's the guitar, really, that matters. my guess is heavy metal, as well as ziggy stardust and the rest, always played a role in what got gary fired up enough to strap on a guitar in the first place. i'd be interested to know how many numan fans have been turned on to goth, indust rock, NIN, manson and that lot because of gary. remember the dark majesty and their thousand points of light, alec ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 09:14:50 -0000 From: thoutby@fusiongroup.co.uk (Tim Houtby) Subject: Hmmm..... To: "Digest" "Replica79" says: " I've been a Numan fan since 1980 (I was nine years old when "Cars" first hit the U.S. charts) and I have to say that this is his most uninteresting album since "Exile" HEY GUESS WHAT REP - IT'S HIS ONLY ALBUM SINCE EXILE !! " I can't imagine how anyone who owns his earlier material could consider this his best work. " LETS PUT THAT TO A POLL THEN - YOU MIGHT BE SURPRISED, 79. He was an innovator of the electronic music revolution and has all but turned his back on "his" style so he can sound like Marilyn Manson. IF YOU DON'T CHANGE YOU GET LEFT BEHIND. THINGS HAVE TO CHANGE. IF THEY DON'T, THEY DIE. SEE "PUNK", "NEW ROMANTICS", FOR EXAMPLES. " I don't get it. I call it the Bowie syndrome where an important artist influences a whole new crop of successful musicians and rather than continue on with what they do best they try to emulate what their followers are doing. " I CALL IT ART WITH DIRECTION. " Anyway... I'm sorry if this upsets anyone I'm not criticizing your taste in music I'm just disapointed in Gary becoming a Heavy Metal musician... " OH, COME ON !! THIS IS NOT HEAVY METAL. AND YOU KNOW IT (Have you listened to ALL the tracks on Pure?). AND BY THE WAY - I'M NOT UPSET. JUST CONFUSED BY YOUR COMMENTS. I don't suppose I'll be the only one replying to your mail either, 79. Peace to you too. Tim. ________________________________________________________________________ This message has been checked for all known viruses, by Star Internet, delivered through the MessageLabs Virus Control Centre. For further information visit: http://www.star.net.uk/stats.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 09:01:35 -0500 From: "Gean, Shawn" Subject: How cold is Pure? To: "'digest@garynumanfan.nu'" I can sympathize with Replica79 about Numan's best work being Telekon... I believe a friend of mine said it best... "Numan was much colder back then." now, by comparison his music is almost warm.... ;^) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 18:36:11 EST From: Numaniac@aol.com Subject: PURE the Album To: digest@garynumanfan.nu lemme ask you guys somethin'....why do people come to the digest to complain? I could've swore that this was for numanoids to gather and relate to their likings. call me crazy but saying that you don't like an album isn't really...eh...well, there's not point to it. and sure, people try to be sporty about it "this is just my opinion" but let's not fool ourselves, we take every 'opinion' to heart. it just baffles me. if there's an album of gary's that you just can't cozy up to then i say just drop it, don't listen to it, ya' know. but that's me. I conform easily and adjust to ALL of his material. believe it or not, i LIKE machine and soul. and yes, i am complaining about complaining...but atleast i ain't complainin' about Gary's music or beliefs. oh, I WONDER... John ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 21:22:47 -0000 From: "Gary Perkins" Subject: Radio Numan To: "Gary Numan Digest" In the last digest, Paddy Vickers asked if anyone had heard anything from Pure on the radio. Unfortunately not. But in the early hours of the morning following the Brixton gig, I did hear Cars and Are Friends, recorded at Brixton, played back on a dictaphone. It was 12.55 am and the station was TalkSport. Tommy Boyd (of Magpie fame for those of a certain age) was just starting the handover to the next guy, who's name excapes me. This guy was very chipper and he was asking Tommy Boyd to guess where he had been. Of course, he had seen Numan and was well pleased with it. He also went backstage after for a chat with Gary and Gemma. For the next hour he kept playing little clips from the gig on his dictaphone and saying how great the gig was. He seemed quite a fan, and if not for the no music policy on TalkSport I feel sure he would have played somthing from Pure. Just Gary's luck. At first Tommy Boyd claimed not to know who Numan was, but then recalled that he was 'that little blond guy from Staines'. Anyway, only vaguely related to the question but it was an interesting hour of listening for me. Gary P ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2000 12:07:35 -0800 From: alecw Subject: thank you, marilyn To: digest@garynumanfan.nu dear digestrium, well i just bought pure too. i had trouble finding it (sold out?) i'll have to take back some of my last e-mail that assumed it was something that it wasn't. i'll have to disagree with myself a little bit. had to get that out there. i hadn't bought pure yet and so i thought it was going to be more of the same plus marilyn manson stylings. i am wrong. there's so much numan-ness in this. he's going for some very interesting emotional colors. great CD. the next logical step in the sacrifice-exile cycle. it's great. i'm glad to hear a big production, too. he sounds inspired and in control. a good CD to blast eveyone back to their cosmic origins with. that's what gary's all about: big things, big alienation, big religion, big music industry, big heart, big show, big songs. the brown clouds are great. very dreamy and evil. the font is not that good. i agree with everyone else about not being able to read it. the album looks great. it should be vinyl so we could experience the big majesty of that cover. that photo of gary where it's all warped and full of pain would've also been a great cover. it looks good with just a clear plastic jewel box cover and the brown cloud disc seen beneath. even that would've been enough. i like the beatles harmonies in "my jesus." really nice!! i've never heard him address those kind psychedelic pop vocal stylings. this record has that same monolyth feel of the last two. there are some nice stops and starts. thank you, gary. thank you for all those awesome little odd breaks and interesting noises. very refreshing. christian symbology and that whole category is hard to not make heavy-handed because that's not the point of christianity in the big institution sense. it's very heavy-handed in its promotion. he's still sick of the big judeo-christian institutions and all their wizards in funny hats, working deeply in the big fear and the big guilt business. their capes flutter and they wave their crooked sticks, coming between him and the universal power source. seems like he's sincere about it and i get the feeling that's how he sees it. it's big and gary's about big. my impression is that gary is looking for reasons--"i need new reasons"--to believe in god, angels and the whole sun cycle, death-and-redemption epic itself. he wants passionately to believe in something. after all, "we are the pleasure creation...gone wrong" with "no religion" and "no relief." he's all about gargoyles, shadows, columns, ivy, ghosts, water, mist, rainbows, big, evil brown cloud formations all looking for god. no wonder he and john foxx get along so well these days. these songs are made for some huge base, huge dynamic light shows and gary in full conviction, swirling around on stage, cape fluttering. anyway, thank you, marilyn and trent and whoever else helped gary to realize it was OK to be a glam rock star doing his own thing again. g'day, alexi von l'hospitaller macbloodsworthe ------------------------------ End of Gary Numan Digest ****************************** ------------------------------------------------------------------- T H E G A R Y N U M A N D I G E S T is produced and distributed by Derek Langsford, Dave Datta, and Joey Lindstrom dlangs@sunstroke.sdsu.edu, datta@cs.uwp.edu, Joey@GaryNumanFan.NU ------------------------------------------------------------------- To reply to the messages in this list, email: digest@GaryNumanFan.NU If you want to be removed, or someone wants to be added, email: digest-request@GaryNumanFan.NU ------------------------------------------------------------------ The Gary Numan Digest is brought to you via Joey Lindstrom and the GaryNUmanFan server Joey@GaryNumanFan.NU All of the opinions in this digest belong to the respective authors and do not necessarily agree with those of the Digest Producers. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Produced and distributed by Derek Langsford dlangs@sunstroke.sdsu.edu -------------------------------------------------------------------------- To reply to the messages in this list, mail to: digest@garynumanfan.nu If you want to be removed, or someone wants to be added, you can mail to digest-request@garynumanfan.nu --------------------------------------------------------------------------